Re: The Religious Debate

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: : You (Unit3) are trying to ask people to prove to you that there is a god. You want scientific theories, postulates or evidence? I say thats ignorance. : No, ignorance would be a lack of knowledge. I want more knowledge, in this case proof of god. Perhaps I should have made this more clear before, I consider myself more of an agnostic than an athiest: I require proof of god(s) before I'll believe in it, but I certainly don't expect others to require proof. I was simply providing a rebuttal to the comment that people who don't believe in god are "awfully weak and ignorant". Simply put, "Sniper Wolf" asked why YC needs proof of god(s), and I asked why he doesn't. Maybe I was a little insulting with that bridge thing, but I still believe it's a valid question: why do you believe what you do without any proof to justify that belief? : : God, or the belief in 'a god', is what got the human race to where it is today, : How do you figure it? I thought that technological innovation, exploration, exploitation of 3rd world labour and the advance of captialism has got us where we are today. : : and yet you propose that we now burn our bridges and ignore everything that your ancestors once founded this country upon? : What, killing the native people and taking their land? I'm only being half sarcastic here, since the main reason for exploration of North America was to look for gold and to exploit its natural resources. This hardly seems to have anything to do with religion. : : There are some things you can not prove, and this is one of them. Does that mean that you are weak because you follow the religion of your family? : I don't think I ever said anything suggesting this. I said that ignorance comes from ignoring logic, but I also said that it is still possible to believe in a god or gods and still think logically about it. : : I think that is an incredibly insulting statement towards any type of organized religion, and a bold statement to make considering you obviously don't understand the fundamentals of every religion there is. : What, that you should still be logical, even about religion. *REREAD WHAT I SAID*. I said I have no problem with people who believe in religion, I have a problem with people who don't have critical thinking skills, and refuse to see any other view but their own. : : You can throw out all the web links you want in this battle and it won't help you a bit. Wake up call: the majority of the world DOES believe in a higher power, and you are the minority if you don't. I don't mean that to shove it to you, because I can't tell you if there is a god because I don't know. But don't try and fight off religion by saying its a minority when its not. : Again, RE READ WHAT I SAID before you get all pissed off. "Sniper Wolf" made a comment asking YC if he felt that he was left out of society because he didn't believe in religion. I found this insulting, so I pointed out that people who are non-religious are certainly a big part of society. I certainly never said religion was a minority, sheesh. : : True ignorance is not being able to see both sides of the fence. I fully understand conversation on the presence of a god, but anti-religious comments that have no justification have no place on this board. : Again, I wasn't trying to be directly anti-religious. I was trying to protest the way "Sniper Wolf" was talking to YC about religion: insulting comments with absolutely no backing. To quote myself, since you obviously didn't read/understand what I was trying to say: : "You can believe in a god/creator/whatever and still believe in rational thought, since it's quite easy to postulate the creation of the universe by a being or group of beings. But insults and force as a way of spreading your views does nothing to make your views more popular" : This was the point of what I'm trying to say: if you want to convince people about your beliefs, don't be insulting, and don't make statements that don't make any sense. : To be honest, I don't even know why I have to explain this. I thought it was obvious that I took offense to the tone of "Sniper Wolf"'s comments and that's what I was argueing against, and that the insulting things I said were simply in direct response to offensive things he said. It seems a little hypocritical that you're so offended by me making retaliatory comments, but you have no problem with the stuff "Sniper Wolf" said, simply because he wasn't targetting your beliefs. : I have never had a problem with religion in general, only with the actions of certain religions and with the ways followers of certain religions act. : : If you like proof, I'd like you to prove to me that there isn't a higher power. I think you'd find it far more challenging than proving that there is. : And this is why I'm an agnostic. I will disbelieve in the existance of god(s) until I see some proof, but I don't believe they can't exist. I honestly *would* like to understand why people believe in organized religions, other than the "well someone must have created the Earth".

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